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Post by Beej on Nov 5, 2004 21:38:50 GMT -5
"And if you call my comments 'vast generalizations,' dare I say that your comments are stubborn denials of reality and repetitions of trite platitudes?"
You can say whatever you wish...they are still nothing but inaccurate generalizations. The truth is you've had every opportunity to refute my (or other conservatives') positions with reasoned arguments based on substantive facts. Instead, you've done little more than flick boogers in this thread and submit your own unsubstantiated opinions as proof. If you wish to be taken seriously in this discussion, you need to construct better arguments.
"But that does not mean that everyone who wants to work actually has a job."
Of course not. 100% employment is not realistic. There is a natural flow to the job market that's affected by countless economic, domestic and external factors. Some job sectors are traditionally more stabile than others...but there will ALWAYS be jobs out there that need filled. It's an undeniable fact.
"Tell that [to] a 53 year old factory worker. You think he has a chance, even with a master's degree to get hired somewhere? "
You know factory workers with Master's Degrees? Or are you referring to a management position? Either way, employers would be THRILLED to have an experienced, competent worker like your hypothetical 53-year-old. I don't know where you live or which people you're talking about, but it's been my experience that middle-aged men and women are easier to train/re-train than younger workers. I own my own business. If you give me the option, I'll take the experienced, reliable worker any day of the week.
That's reality. Younger workers might be cheaper...but older workers tend to be more productive and conscientious. They take pride in their work and realize the value of their job to the stability of their households. Employers have different philosophies.
You can't simply throw out some blanket statement about NO JOBS, however, when over 2 million have been added to this economy nationwide in the past year...and when I open the newspaper and see two or three pages of help wanted ads every day.
The employment conditions of your area may not be an accurate representation of the nation as a whole. Trust me, people are finding jobs.
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Post by Beej on Nov 5, 2004 21:56:10 GMT -5
"Sure. The winner should have the right to curtail others right to free speech. Great country! Thank you that's all I needed to hear. Dissenters have to be silenced at any cost ... "I'll reiterate... "We welcome dissent and open debate. All we ask is that you ... do us the courtesy of educating yourself on the issues before challenging our positions. In other words, if Michael Moore is your primary source of information, you're simply not equipped to have a rational, sensible discussion on ANY topic. It's okay to speak your mind...this is America...I just request that you have a point and be willing and able to support your position with something more than opinion or emotion."I keep holding out hope, Tabby, that you'll do us the courtesy. 
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Post by tabby on Nov 5, 2004 22:05:05 GMT -5
I gladly will, Sir. But what I am talking about is Peach's request to lock a thread on the Alltempts board because she felt that we should be silenced or she would no longer post on that board. I think you missed that fact, Sir. So she actually demanded that her opponents be silenced! No lie. That is very sad, don't even you think so?
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Post by tabby on Nov 5, 2004 22:06:35 GMT -5
I gladly will, Sir. But what I am talking about is Peach's request to lock a thread on the Alltempts board because she felt that we should be silenced or she would no longer post on that board. I think you missed that fact, Sir. So she actually demanded that her opponents be silenced! No lie. That is very sad, don't even you think so? Oh and by the way, I haven't read MM's book nor seen the movie. I usually consult serious journalistic sources for info. |
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Post by tabby on Nov 5, 2004 22:08:53 GMT -5
"And if you call my comments 'vast generalizations,' dare I say that your comments are stubborn denials of reality and repetitions of trite platitudes?"You can say whatever you wish...they are still nothing but inaccurate generalizations. The truth is you've had every opportunity to refute my (or other conservatives') positions with reasoned arguments based on substantive facts. Instead, you've done little more than flick boogers in this thread and submit your own unsubstantiated opinions as proof. If you wish to be taken seriously in this discussion, you need to construct better arguments. "But that does not mean that everyone who wants to work actually has a job."Of course not. 100% employment is not realistic. There is a natural flow to the job market that's affected by countless economic, domestic and external factors. Some job sectors are traditionally more stabile than others...but there will ALWAYS be jobs out there that need filled. It's an undeniable fact. "Tell that [to] a 53 year old factory worker. You think he has a chance, even with a master's degree to get hired somewhere? "You know factory workers with Master's Degrees? Or are you referring to a management position? Either way, employers would be THRILLED to have an experienced, competent worker like your hypothetical 53-year-old. I don't know where you live or which people you're talking about, but it's been my experience that middle-aged men and women are easier to train/re-train than younger workers. I own my own business. If you give me the option, I'll take the experienced, reliable worker any day of the week. That's reality. Younger workers might be cheaper...but older workers tend to be more productive and conscientious. They take pride in their work and realize the value of their job to the stability of their households. Employers have different philosophies. You can't simply throw out some blanket statement about NO JOBS, however, when over 2 million have been added to this economy nationwide in the past year...and when I open the newspaper and see two or three pages of help wanted ads every day. The employment conditions of your area may not be an accurate representation of the nation as a whole. Trust me, people are finding jobs. Sure because you say so. PS: I've heard the same statement from my plumber a while ago ;D |
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Post by Beej on Nov 5, 2004 22:27:29 GMT -5
"I usually consult serious journalistic sources for info."
The New York Times editorial page?
;D
"That is very sad, don't even you think so?"
I can't comment on an incident that happened elsewhere without knowing the particulars.
I was speaking to the general claim of "winners" wanting to silence dissent. If that was a reference to a personal beef with Peach over a specific incident on another board, it wasn't apparent in your post.
"Sure because you say so."
No, because the Department of Labor says so.
"I gladly will, Sir."
When do you intend to start? So far, you've balanced between argumentative and glib. If there's a sensible, well-reasoned point coming, I'd appreciate a heads-up so I don't miss it.
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Post by brunneng on Nov 6, 2004 10:25:37 GMT -5
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Post by tabby on Nov 6, 2004 14:13:07 GMT -5
"When do you intend to start? So far, you've balanced between argumentative and glib. If there's a sensible, well-reasoned point coming, I'd appreciate a heads-up so I don't miss it ..." I give my honest opinions here, not trying to lecture anyone or trying to force my way of handling an issue upon others. Also, I don't have to demonstrate my being educated by correcting others' bad English -- as, for example -- pointing out a forgotten preposition. There is room on this board for individuality that includes the way people approach subjects and even spelling. What newspaper to you suggest one should read? What radio programs should one tune in to? I don't see anything wrong with the NYT. |
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Post by Beej on Nov 6, 2004 17:37:53 GMT -5
"I give my honest opinions here, not trying to lecture anyone or trying to force my way of handling an issue upon others."
No, you've been attacking conservative viewpoints throughout this thread. When I challenged you to back it up with something other than your opinions, you were either unwilling or unable to do so. I'm not picking on you, Tabby. I'm saying that if you're going to direct your criticism at me or anyone else, you need to be able to defend your position with concrete fact. I'm not going to let anything directed at me or my beliefs go unchallenged.
"Also, I don't have to demonstrate my being educated by correcting others' bad English -- as, for example -- pointing out a forgotten preposition."
Forgive me. My degree is in Political Science with a double minor in Criminal Law and English Composition. All three require specific and deliberate use of language. If I happen to correct your grammar or spelling in a quotation, it's probably a subconscious act. It's certainly not meant to embarrass or demean you.
"What newspaper to you suggest one should read? What radio programs should one tune in to? I don't see anything wrong with the NYT."
C-SPAN is the only truly independent source you're going to find. I'd say read as many papers as you can, but balance them. If you read the New York Times then also see what the Washington Times has to say about the same stories. If you watch CNN, flip over to FOXNews for a different take. Everyone filters the news to some degree...if you balance the coverage and consider the information, you'll be much better off than just sticking to the one or two sources that agree with your views all the time.
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Post by brunneng on Nov 6, 2004 18:28:16 GMT -5
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ ...and here I thought the election was over. I did once vote for a Republican, the best one of them all! Honest Abe Lincoln...where are you when we need you buddy? ;D  ...what can make me feel this way... |
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Post by Peach on Nov 6, 2004 20:50:52 GMT -5
I gladly will, Sir. But what I am talking about is Peach's request to lock a thread on the Alltempts board because she felt that we should be silenced or she would no longer post on that board. I think you missed that fact, Sir. So she actually demanded that her opponents be silenced! No lie. That is very sad, don't even you think so? That is the last straw........I've held my tongue *long* enough. I did not ask the thread to be locked. She locked it on her own..... you know why? Because you were being just like you are right now......a :censored There, I've said it. I don't know what you're problem is, but I'm sick of it. You find nothing wrong with ganging up on people? That's exactly what you're doing..... and you've turned into a real :censored Thanks for your pleasant attitude and for running another one off....... Peach |
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Post by brunneng on Nov 6, 2004 20:57:38 GMT -5
Wouldn't you guys rather answer my Thanksgiving thread? The next 8-9 weeks are my favorite times of the year. Peace on earth and all that.  ...sunshine on a cloudy day... |
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Post by Peach on Nov 6, 2004 21:11:50 GMT -5
Wouldn't you guys rather answer my Thanksgiving thread? The next 8-9 weeks are my favorite times of the year. Peace on earth and all that. ...sunshine on a cloudy day... No, we'd rather make enemies and all that good stuff. You know, because that's what politics does.... and that's why, when people want to remain on good terms and friendly, they AVOID topics like that.....which isn't censorship.....it's GOOD SENSE and TACTFULNESS because some things just can't be discussed in a civil manner. (Especially with hot heads, like me which I admit to.) Peach Peach |
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Post by brunneng on Nov 6, 2004 21:17:51 GMT -5
No, we'd rather make enemies and all that good stuff. You know, because that's what politics does.... and that's why, when people want to remain on good terms and friendly, they AVOID topics like that.....which isn't censorship.....it's GOOD SENSE and TACTFULNESS because some things just can't be discussed in a civil manner. (Especially with hot heads, like me which I admit to.) Peach Peach Peach, Peach! Ha! If you were any cuter, I'd make you into a Peach pie! ...get ready... |
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Post by Beej on Nov 7, 2004 5:55:22 GMT -5
Hi, Peach... I'm sorry I missed all the excitement on that other board. We could've teamed up like Bonnie and Clyde. Or Weezie and George. ;D To be honest, there's nothing worth getting aggravated over on a message board. Sometimes, that's exactly the response people are trying to elicit. I don't take anything said here to heart. Sure, we disagree and go back and forth, but there's no ill-will at the end of the day. I'm accustomed to having face-to-face shouting matches over politics...these exchanges with Tabby and others have been cordial by comparison. This is fun for me. ;D Hey, hon'... next time somebody starts to get under your skin, here's what you do: 1: Stand up and walk away from your computer; 2: Load The Temptations Sing Smokey into your CD player; 3: Skip to song # 3 and listen for the opening bass line...then the guitar riff; 4: As soon as Mr. Ruffin starts to tell a little story about "sunshine" and a "cloudy day," all your troubles will disappear. If that doesn't work... 5: Reach through the monitor and strangle that miserable SOB on the other end until he passes out. Either way, you'll have peace and harmony. |
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