Article re: Paul's death

[Temptress]

The only thing I could find on Otis* related to drugs* in his book on page 127 & 128.........................
My first cocaine experience took place during one of our recordbreaking runs at the Apollo. The demand for ticketswas so great that when we came out the stage door to go go eat after the show, we would see the line of people waiting for the next show winding all the way around the block. Fame was still new enough that certain scenes stuck me as unreal, and this was one I'll never forget.
At the time we were hanging with some guyswhom we still see today. We were between shows, and one of them said "Man, you motherfuckers were killing them down there. Come on, take at hitod this here. " In his outstretched hand he held a nice quanity of white powder-cocaine.
I declined" Coke aint my thing. Thanks anyway.
"Come on," he persisted " Celebrate just this one time." He kept at me, and in a moment of weakness and, of out curiosity, I gave in.
"All right, give me a hit." I hit, and was surprised to find that it felt a lot better then I excepted. I felt this beautiful surge od energy. so I hit it again and again.
We finished the show and went back to our hotel to rest up for the next day. This run was scheduled so that we did four shows a day then, which is grueling no matter how young you are. It was exhausting, or at leastit should have been. Back in my room I craweled into bed, closed my eyes, and waited to doze off, but I couldn't . Then I felt eyes pop open-boing!-like in a cartoon. They would not close, and I felt jittery. I got up and walked the halls for hours,from two in the morning until ten the next day. By the time I'd finally worn myself down enough to sleep, we were due back at the Apollo.
Dragging my butt onstage, I tried to do my best but from the first downbeat I knew it was all over. Everything I did or sang came out either too fast or too slow. My timing was totally off, and people definetly noticed that something was up. I looked out into the first rows and saw people whispering to each other and pointing at me. It broke ky heart. I was never so ashamed of myself. Only God was going to get me through this one, so I said a silent prayer right on stage:" Lord , if youlet me off, I will not do that anymore." Sure enough I never did, and I never forgot that. I couldn't stand the idea of something controlling my mind and my body. That's probably why the whole drug scene today upsets me so. Lord knows I've seen my share of ot first hand, and I still can't comperhend why anyone would willingfully submit himself to the tyanny of drugs.

We all make bad decisions in life. But will we learn from them?

[Ivory Fair]

I know plenty of people who despise Otis and knew him during the time when drug use was more commonly accepted than it is today, people who are all too quick to share anything negative about him that they can and the ONLY drugs I've ever heard him having a problem with are MONEY and WOMEN.

[mcribs]

MikeNYC said:

Kalisa,can you show me a documented FACT that Paul was a alcoholic? And,yes what is wrong with bringing up ,or asking why nobody is saying anything about Otis' faults?

Mike--what do you need, an engraved invitation? PLEASE post Otis' faults and we will talk them to death.

[Aba21]

I still believe that he had the right to write any kind of book he wanted. He was there. I agree that if he is being held accountable for what he said so should Eddie. The other guys chose not to write or tell and I applaud them for their decision. I expect Otis be lambasted for some of the things he wrote but he still had the right to write it. He had to know he would anger some.

In terms of his own faults, I'm still waiting to discuss anything about him that we have not discussed all ready. I'm not saying he didn't do anything but what did he do that hasn't been discussed?

Even if what Eddie said didn't go any further than Detroit......are those people anymore strangers to Paul than anybody else who didn't know him.............and by being in Detroit.you think his family didn't see those quotes from Eddie. No body is saying what Eddie said was bad so why is what Otis said so bad.

We have about 300 members on this board, most of whom never saw the classic five perform. How are you going to use this small amount of people to ascertain whether or not anybody saw Paul drunk on stage with Richard singing for him or whether David was at all the shows? This is not a fair and equitable cross section of Temptaion fans from that era to be able to ask that question. Maybe a poll of who actually saw the C-5 perform would give us a better read on the number of those on this board who could even begin to answer the question.

And as far as what Otis was thinking when he wrote the things he wrote, how can anyone on here answer that question? How can anyone speak to what any of them were actually thinking?

[mcribs]

And Mike, I was talking about this very topic with my Mom (expert in all things David Ruffin, 55+ Division) and she said that she had heard things in the press in the 60's(NOT from Otis) about David's drug use. She said that when Paul was found dead that the announcement of his death included reports that he was a heavy drinker who had had health problems in recent years. She did NOT get her information from the movie, she never read Otis' book, and has never been to Detroit. Paul's and David's issues were public knowledge and as such, Otis was not telling tales on them in his book.

Now, back to the fun stuff...what's the dirt on Otis??? Do tell!!!

[Ivory Fair]

Maybe we need to be asking Mike if he has ever SEEN Ali Woodson using a trick microphone.

[MikeNYC]

kalisa2 said:

ok, well the bottom line to ME is, if it wasn't Otis's place to tell it, then it sure wasn't anymore Eddie's place to tell it, so why is Otis worse than Eddie for telling it?

Telling what? What do you say Eddie is telling?

[MikeNYC]

kalisa2 said:

Alcoholic is a strong term, and one best used by someone who diagnosed him as that...not me. But his best friend said "He drank and ran around"...and that he had "seen him drunk". Two mentions of alcohol abuse in one article in referencing his performances gives it more importance than mere social once-in-a-while drinking...it was a problem.

This states USE,not ABUSE . Nowhere is Eddie quoted as saying "ALCOHOLIC" is he? You are assuming what you want him to mean.Nowhere is Eddie quoted as saying that the man was an alcoholic....!I know peolpe that m
have seen me drunk,does this mean I have a "problem?"

[MikeNYC]

kalisa2 said:

I certainly can't say this was not the case...but don't know what it has to do with the discussion at hand? Did OTIS know he had the disease or gene or whatever? Even still, the fact is, according to Paul's best friend, Paul drank and Paul's drinking was a problem and affected performances.

It has a lot to do with what we are discussing. Do you know that the illness that Paul had was the main reason in Paul's problems and the alledged drinking was the aftermath? You don't know this. I don't know who Paul's best friend that you are talking about,but Eddie never was quoted as saying Paul was an alcoholic.

[MikeNYC]

kalisa2 said:

Otis isn't smokey nor martha nor gladys. He chose to tell his story the way he chose to tell it, and yes it was in part his story, as what the other people in the group did that affected the temptations certainly affected him. Most of the personal business he told had to do with problems that affected their performances as Temptations, at least in his view.

Kalisa,you brought up something about telling dirt,and how unreal his book would be without it..I just showed you that's not true. Each of the three I mentioned told a story WITHOUT telling other people's business.
They showed class. Otis did not. On top of that,he said in his revised edition that he was going to say things that he didn't say before now that Eddie AND Deavid were no longer with us. That,my dear was Otis spitting on their graves. No,he had no right putting that garbage in print form.I'm sorry that fact escapes you...to me that's sad.Truth be told as Gladys,Smokey and Martha showed...you don't have to trash groupmates to tell a story. That's the bottom line.

[MikeNYC]

kalisa2 said:

Mike...read the opening article of this thread, which was "out there" in 1973, a full 15 years before Otis's book was published. The information was out there...why do you deny it? It was put out there by his best friend, so obviously was not a huge secret.

Kalisa,the Detroit Free Press is not a national publication,it is a LOCAL newspaper.No,it was not common knowledge,I can't confirm what you are saying because it's not correct.Like I said before,it wasn't common knowledge that the group sang R&B,and you expect me to go along with this? NOPE,not in this lifetime.

[kalisa2]

This states USE,not ABUSE . Nowhere is Eddie quoted as saying "ALCOHOLIC" is he? You are assuming what you want him to mean.Nowhere is Eddie quoted as saying that the man was an alcoholic....!I know peolpe that m
have seen me drunk,does this mean I have a "problem?"

and

I don't know who Paul's best friend that you are talking about,but Eddie never was quoted as saying Paul was an alcoholic.

Mike...you're now putting words in MY mouth. I did not use the term 'alcoholic'. Did Otis? (honest question, I don't have my book handy) The lead article here on this thread said Paul had been treated for alcoholism. But I still did not use the term 'alcoholic'. I DID say 'problem'. I made no assumptions. Eddie mentioned Paul's alcohol use TWICE in the article, and in conjunction with deterioration of performances...this makes it ABuse and a problem, if it was interferring with his (and everyone's) livelihood. Why are you going into denial about this? I don't know you well enough to know if YOU allow alcohol to interfer with your personal life, social life or work life. Paul's was interferring at the very least with his work life. Again, that makes it alcohol ABuse.

If the alcohol use were not important nor a problem nor abuse, why did Eddie mention it at all? You know the others in the group drank, including Eddie himself, but no mention was made of that. The only reason Eddie could have had for mentioning it at all was that IT WAS A PROBLEM, in his mind.

***Actually, Eddie mentioned it THREE times, the first being when he said Paul had apparently overcome his ALCOHOL PROBLEM. His words, not mine. Alcohol problem is equal to abuse of alcohol, not just use.

[Aba21]

You say they served drinks at a party that Paul was at. How do you know such a party happened? Did you get that from Otis movie or book? And how do you know Otis had anything to do with the party? Nobody is trying to make anybody look bad but Eddie said the man drank and it became a problem. Whether he used the words alcoholic or not is not the question. The question concerns it becoming a problem for the group. Otis had a right to write that.

And to whether it was public knowledge or not MCRibs mother just said she knew............I knew and most Tempt fans over 50 knew.................It was not a big deal back then and its not a big deal now. Its just part of the story.

[kalisa2]

MikeNYC said:

Telling what? What do you say Eddie is telling?

Mike...you're getting on my last nerve with that question. Read the lead article.

[MikeNYC]

kalisa2 said:

Once more, I will say it ("it" being Pauls alcohol use/abuse and deterioration of performance) was part and parcel of the story of the Temptations, not just his private life, and as such was most certainly as much Otis's story to tell as anybody's, since it affect his life and livelihood also.

And once more I will say Otis had no right trashing Paul like he did. That was his intent to do it,otherwise he would have at least amend the name under that damn photo of Paul with the drink in his hand and the woman on his lap. He did it to make money.Profit.
It was NOT Otis' story to tell. will say this every time this subject is brought up. That's not gonna change.Tell HIS life,not someone else's. I would have liked to read the reason Kenny Gamble didn't sign the group. Not glossed over,but what the hell happened?That would have been a better read than trashing groupmates...especially the ones who are not alive to defend themselves. To me,shows disrespect to the members. Why do you deny that? It was not Otis' story to tell.