DID WE DIS BLACK HISTORY MONTH?

[Jonel]

It's this one:

[janebse]

Regarding intimacy and dating, there is a new book out by a black Harvard law professor on the subject of interracial intimacies from the legal standpoint. I've just read the first chapter so far, but it's an intriguing subject and beautifully handled.

And your thesis is excellent. Are you suggesting that in the black churches or churches predominantly black, the female has an inferior role due to interpretation of Biblical passages? I thought the black female played an important role in the black church.

I gather you are suggesting this is more of a problem than in churches of other cultures. I would think the Islam church has even more of a problem with that subject, but then I only know what's in the news.

[iratherlikeme]

And your thesis is excellent. Are you suggesting that in the black churches or churches predominantly black, the female has an inferior role due to interpretation of Biblical passages? I thought the black female played an important role in the black church.

Women do play important roles in the black church, but there are certain roles that they are allowed to play. There is only enough leeway to become important in those certain roles that they have been given. She can be on the Mother's Board, but I rarely see a female deacon. The only time she'll conduct devotion may be during the Women's Day program. She can raise money for Pastor's Aide, but she can't be a trustee. It's about things like that.

Some pastors won't let women preachers into the pulpit. My pastor is slightly unconventional when it comes to things like that, I suppose, because he says it's not his pulpit, it's God's pulpit. He can't say that God hasn't chosen a woman to preach.

Thanks, Jonel. I'll have to make my way to the library tomorrow to read the article.

[Ivory Fair]

IRLM, let me offer some counter-argumets to your thesis....

To me it's not a question of whether or not churches should "allow" women to be pulpit ministers, or hold "offices." That's not a decision that's ours to make and I'll tell you why, but first let's go over a few fundamentals......

The Bible is the divinely inspired word of God. (II Timothy 3:16 "All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness")


With that said, the word of God is not something that we can change to suit our own needs or desires. It's not something that changes over time. The very commandments that God instructed the New Testament Church (through Paul for example) are the same commandments we are to follow today. (Matt 5:18 "For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled." )


The Apostle Paul CLEARLY instructs that women are not to be pulpit ministers. ("Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence" (1 Tim 2:11-12). The word "teach," here is translated from the verb didasko, and it means "to deliver didactic discourses." One cannot preach without delivering a "didactic discourse."

Nor are they to be elders (I Timothy 3:2 "A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife,")


So with that said, no matter how WE think things ought to be, you can't argue with God so you can't argue with the Scripture. God clearly does not want women to preach or hold offices in the church. And I challenge you to show me any scripture that says otherwise (and don't waste your time looking because you won't find any, haha.) There's no way to get around that. There are a lot of grey areas in the Bible, but the role of women is not one of them.

My theory, and this is TOTALLY my theory, ......... think of any church you've been familar with. The backbone of that church is ALWAYS the women. I think (and I say this partially in a joking manner) is that if God didn't restrict women from certain roles, thereby forcing men to do SOMETHING, we'd run the whole operation and the guys woulnd't do a thing!

But that doesn't mean that women aren't important. Kind of going along with what Jane alluded to, think of women like Martha and the two Marys. They were as close to Jesus as the Apostles were and certainly had a role. And just like men, women are instructed to MINISTER (which is not the same as preaching) to everyone. As a matter of fact, that's what I'm doing now.

But to answer your question......... check out BET's show "Let's Talk Church" and see if they have any transcripts of old show, they did this topic on a show a few months ago. Also, while my father is obviously a white dude our church is about 75% African American. If this qualifies as the kind of church you're looking at, I'm sure he'd be happy to talk to you about it and I'd be happy to get you in contact with him. If you'd rather talk to a female, I can line you up at least 10 or 15 of my "aunts" at church who'll say the same thing I just said.

[iratherlikeme]

All right, Ivory. ;D I definitely think I should start reading my Bible more often.

So Paul says women can't be pulpit ministers, but she can minister (like any "good Christian" should). I'm under the impression that an evangelist is basically someone without a church. And since there is no actual pulpit, can she do that then? Or is it not even about the pulpit but just the principle?

Is "Let's Talk Church" that show with Bobby Jones?

[sukkafu]

(My theory, and this is TOTALLY my theory, ......... think of any church you've been familar with. The backbone of that church is ALWAYS the women. I think (and I say this partially in a joking manner) is that if God didn't restrict women from certain roles, thereby forcing men to do SOMETHING, we'd run the whole operation and the guys woulnd't do a thing! )

we have a joke in our church that the reason the men run the show is so the women will make them feel important because the women are more faithful, more righteous, and more dutiful.
Jesus Christ is the champion of women. who was the first to see the resurrected Lord-a woman!
who was told by an angel to inform the apostles about the stone rolled away from the tomb-2 women!
he spoke to the samaritan woman by the well, and also spent a lot of time with lazarus' sisters.
women are not to be mummies, but even more important -mommies! mother's love is next to God's!
creating life is countless times better than being a ceo of a company!

[sukkafu]

we were gone to big bear lake, and we caught a special on TLC channel-it was interesting- called the new york slaves and it was about slavery in nyc in the early 1700's and it showed a re-enactment of a slave uprising in the city and the horrible tortures they endured.
very interesting program.

[Aba21]

See we are now dicussing Black History. I want only that in school when Black History is taught is that the TRUTH BE TOLD. Just as our treatment of the Indians was horrendous so was that of the Black man but he has contributed in so many ways to the world in education and inventions as well as entertainment and athletics that the whole story must be told. Don't sugar coat it and don't leave anything out. Tell the whole story. It is just as important as any other we tell. Then we don't need a month to celebrate it. We all have a legacy and a history. We all have a calling in life. We can live and work and play together as you can see on this board when we need to research something everybody chips in. Tha's all I want. Everybody chip in.

[Ivory Fair]

Yeah, that's the show IRLM. It's the only thing good on TV on Monday mornings at around 2 or 3 am.

[DramaLJDiva]

There are plenty of wonderful female evangelist preachers. The Bible scriptures are interpreted vert differently among most preachers, but I guess that particular scripture that Ivory posted is saying that women should not have their own church, but can still be evangelists and spread the gospel without actually being the head of a church. I am still looking for a good church to go to...the one I attended before I moved overseas is no longer in existence. The denomination is not important; however, I'd like for it to be an integrated church, with members of all colors and nationalities.

[Ivory Fair]

Maybe, but the original language is not. And in the original Greek, the word is "didasko" which means to get up and deliver a message like a precher usually does. ............ But who am *I* to tell YOU about original Greek stuff? ;D

It's too bad Chattanooga is just a BIT too far of a commute for you to go to church, we'd love to have you at my family church. And I call it my "family" church because I really consider them my family. Closer to me than my own blood kin are.

[sukkafu]

has anybody seen the latest newsweek cover story dated march 3rd-it has beyonce and 2 other ladies and it's about black women success stories.

here's the link-

www.msnbc.com/news/875614.asp?

maybe ivory can cut and paste the cover for us.

[Aba21]

One of the ladies the head financial person at ABC news in New york. I'm sorry I can't recall her name.

[sukkafu]

i was reading the article i linked to , and it says that samuel l. jackson was not happy that his daughter was dating a white man, so they transferred her to an all black female scholl in atlanta, and now she has a black boyfriend, so he's happy.

it also mentions that almost half the black women in the 30-34 age range are single, as opposed to 10 percent of the white female population. marriage among blacks is on the major decline.

you have to take the stats with a grain of salt,thogh, in any essay, because they can be slanted any which way to make a point.

[tdallasw]

Here's a little info I was sent to explain why February was chosen as Black History Month. It was because of the month’s enormous significance in history such as:

The celebration of two historical figures (Abraham Lincoln and Frederick Douglass) who had a great impact on the Black population.

Feb. 23, 1868 - W.E.B. Dubois, a Civil Rights leader and co-founder of the N. A. A. C. P., was born.

Feb. 3, 1870 - The 15th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution was passed, which gave Blacks the right to vote.

Feb. 25, 1870 - The first Black Senator, Hiriam R. Revels took office.

Feb. 12, 1909 - The N.A.A.C.P. (National Association for the Advancement of Colored People) was founded in New York City.